California Surveyors Forums

Copied from "Removed to avoid confusion" thread a few weeks ago. Evan Page and others offered excellent commentary about implications of removing pipes.
A surveyor had received a citation for removal of a point some time back.

Ric Moore also added some very good points as to if there was public reliance on such points prior to removal.

Evan also ended his comments with this observation:

"But then again, I've seen some really upside down results of enforcement cases recently and a lot of inconsistency between the opinions of different Board experts that are the basis for deciding whether or not to cite a licensee. Can't draw any conclusions from the enforcement public write up of the Ehe case."


We all live with the fact of life that as part of practicing professions in this state, for the protection of the public, licensed persons must be willing to accept being watched by various government agencies, in our case, Borpels, per our state codes and regs.

Many of us know from experience that when there is a complaint from the public, a form letter is sent out from Borpels to submit "any and all pertinent information...." (As a side note, contrary to the officially stated DCA/Borpels policy, supporting evidence or information is not needed to open a case file for a complaint.)

My question is, who watches and evaluates the actions of those we pay; the hired "expert" and the two licensed people who comprise "Borpels" ?

I have been in contact with several persons who have been investigated (most of whose cases closed with no action taken) and several others cited by Borpels.

I am interested in receiving from anyone else who is willing, the exact same package of data that had been submitted for their investigations.

There is absolutely no shame in having been investigated. I have sat in JPPC meetings and witnessed several outstanding members honestly raise their hands to reveal they had been the subject of a complaint inquiry or state investigation. This is all part of public licensure; if you are a surveyor long enough, no matter how well you do your job, there will be that unhappy neighbor who did not like the way you established the line for your client.

If anyone who visits this website had the experience of a complaint turning into an investigation, regardless of whether it was dropped or resulted in a citation, I would appreciate your input. All information strictly confidential.
I am anonymous and you will be anonymous.
Please use my private e-mail address located elsewhere on this site.

Maybe Ric Moore and Ray Mathe can also respond with input on this.
Who supervises or reviews your performances, or is there none ?

It may be worthwhile to consider the points I raised in my recent article about "experts," a term you similarly distinguished. What is a Board Expert? I have seen a lot of reports also and I am always compelled to question the qualifications of the person preparing the report(s). In a court of law, there are uniform standards and procedures that assure adherence to some very specific guidelines. In addition, a report needs to be vetted and the person preparing it needs to possess skills other than the ability to fill out a form claiming expertise.

As with a lawyer, an officer of the court, a mediator or an arbitrator, in order to sit in such a role, one has to undergo a certain amount of training, if nothing else, to make sure that procedural mistakes are not made as well as to assure uniformity in the decisions that are made.

I look forward to your findings.

I would imagine the reviewers of Ric & Ray's performance are the members of the State Board which includes 15 members, 8 of which are public (non-licensed) members and 7 of which are licensed (one surveyor, one civil engineer, one electrical engineer, one mechanical engineer, one structural engineer, one from the one of the other engineering fields, one licensed geologist or geophysicist. Ric and Ray are employees of the Board.

Invite us (Ric, Ray, Pat, ?) to speak at your next chapter meeting, conference, etc. and we would be more than to happy to discuss your questions. Sometimes I am able to arrange for other board members to be available depending on the proximity to where they are located and their schedules.

I thought I read you all will be speaking in San Diego in April.
BORPELS . . . G always has a good energetic crowd at the conference.

Now back to the original thread.