California Surveyors Forums

My son is taking the next LSIT. Its been 30 years since I took it.
I remember it being mostly cogo / deed calculations.
Is this still true ?

http://ncees.org/wp-content/uploads/201 ... ranges.pdf

https://account.ncees.org/exam-prep/fs-practice-exam

When I took it, it was much as you describe, but I started hearing of content changes not too many years after that. My understanding is that there is also content regarding computer usage that is not necessarily directly survey related.

http://ncees.org/wp-content/uploads/201 ... ranges.pdf

https://www.amazon.com/1001-Solved-Surv ... 1888577126

Thanks to all.

The test subject matter is more advanced now then when I took in (1984)

Does anyone have a 2nd Edition copy of Van Sickel's book that they're willing to part with? I know someone who wants to study for the LIST but can't afford a new copy.

They can try Amazon (remember to set up your Smile.amazon.com account and designate the CLSA Education Foundation) for used text books, but I would advise that candidates use current version - the 4th edition. That is the most recent version and should best reflect the current NCEES FS exam plan. I saw a used version of the 4th for $80 recently. Spending the money up front for the right study materials could save having to take the exam over.

Also, candidates MUST understand that the FS is an education based exam. It is geared towards those with a BS degree in land surveying. Candidates with "experience only" typically have the lowest pass rate for this exam. Attending LS review classes would also be very beneficial. Availability of a mentor, or even others to study with, is certainly a help as well.

Rob_LS wrote:Also, candidates MUST understand that the FS is an education based exam. It is geared towards those with a BS degree in land surveying. Candidates with "experience only" typically have the lowest pass rate for this exam.

Funny, I perceived the opposite when I took it in 2007. I always encourage students who are preparing for the FS and are lacking practical experience to spend some time in the field and try to understand why they are doing things as opposed to the theoretical approach taught in school. I always considered that the 'experience-only' track delivered a more natural or organic type of learning than reading books or science projects could deliver.

I suppose that the exam could have changed in the last 9 years and I do not hold a surveying BS degree. I only know that I spent way more time typing COGO programs into my HP33 calculator than I did studying for the FS exam and I passed it on the first try. I studied geography and mathematics in college but I still present that it was solid field experience that got me through that test.

When I took it, my sense was that if one was taking it on experience only but had fairly narrow experience (i.e. mostly or all construction and subdivision work), they would have a difficult time with the exam. But if one went in with pretty broad experience, then it wouldn't be all that difficult with or without a degree. The advantage of having a degree going in at that time was primarily that one would have been exposed to a much broader spectrum of areas of practice than would most people by experience alone.

On the other side of the coin, I've known quite a few who went in with all or most of a degree but lacking more than a little practical experience who found the exam to be difficult. However, it's been over 20 years since I took it, so the focus may have significantly changed since that time.

I took it before there was a website but there was a booklet that gave the same type of info. As I recall, the example problems in the booklet (at that time) was at best, mediocre in reflecting the type of content that was in the actual exam. Looking at the test specs that are online now, things are a little different depending on what the actual exam content is. On the exam I took, there were some statistics questions but nothing on least squares, and therefore nothing on linear/matrix algebra. The percentage of geodesy content was perhaps a bit more, but all very basic stuff. I think there were a couple of ethics & safety questions, maybe a contract question, but I don't recall any questions on business topics typically of concern to higher & middle management. I don't recall anything on spreadsheets or other computer program usage, and there was nothing on GIS. I do recall a couple of simple engineering design problems that arguably could have related to construction staking. These were things like determining the proper pipe diameter of a given material to carry a given amount of flow and one or two others relative to gravity flow systems (in some states, LSs are or were authorized to design limited gravity flow channel and pipe systems).

Most of the content looks about the same based on the specs in the link provided above.

Reviewing the link to the syllabus for the FS test was an eye opener for me. I have forgotten more than I know! We do not promote our profession enough. That list contains a lot of disciplines to be charged with knowing and we obviously do not get recognized for knowing them. My 2 cents, Jp

I didn't have to take the LSIT since I am a civil engineer, but this Caltrans course was very helpful in studying for the LS exam. There are many units in this course that would be applicable to the LSIT, particularly the math.
http://www.dot.ca.gov/hq/row/landsurvey ... okTOC.html

Not to be a PITA, (although I am often accused of that) but the exam is the NCEES Fundamentals of Surveying (FS) exam. After passing the FS exam, candidates may submit an application to California's BPELSG for a Land Surveyor in Training (LSIT) certificate. I should have made that distinction earlier.

While I wholeheartedly agree with Mr. Kendall on the critical importance of solid practical field experience, the NCEES FS exam is geared towards graduates of a 4 year BS degree in Land Surveying. The FS page of the NCEES website http://ncees.org/surveying/fs/ clearly states: “The Fundamentals of Surveying (FS) exam is generally your first step in the process to becoming a professional licensed surveyor (P.S.). It is designed for recent graduates and students who are close to finishing an undergraduate engineering degree from an ABET/EAC accredited program.” Additionally, the demographics/statistics show the "experience only" candidates are performing the worst on this exam. California only requires 2 years of Land Surveying education and/or experience to sit for this exam. As a result of the low requirements, a lack of 4 year degree educated candidates, and other factors, our pass rates are far below the national average.

Proud7191 hits the nail on the head. The exam plan demands a lot from the candidates. If we are mentoring either LS or LSIT candidates, we must be familiar with the current exam content and the requirements of the PLS Act (8741, et seq). By guiding them towards those resources, we allow them to learn to perform research and find information on their own.