DWoolley wrote:Ric7308 wrote:Go forward with your personal attacks all you want Dave. Doesn’t bother me. The Board always appreciates hearing the unique perspective from one of its licensees.
I will get back to this...[Ric, in the meantime, read my post again.]
My experience and training indicate folks personalizing legitimate questions - such as benign request for professional qualifications and citations to authority – and then, recounting the questions as “personal attacks” are simply avoiding the questions and retreating to a victim status as a distraction. It is deceptive maneuver that is not uncommon. It could be viewed differently if there was an unwarranted defensive posture and yet, subsequently, the questions were answered after a temper has cooled. Of course, even after patiently waiting a few of days, the questions have not been answered. Frankly, I had no expectation the questions would be answered. Thankfully, forum readers were spared the meaningless editorial gymnastics of a contrived authority stating BPELSG staff dictates practice issues. BPELSG licenses folks and is tasked with the enforcement of the various Acts i.e. Professional Land Surveyors' Act. Enforcement of the written law, law we can all read for ourselves, is not the practice of land surveying. Negligence, a professional lung shot, is determined by expert testimony, not BPELSG staff. In turn, the expert testimony will usually hinge on the duty owed, failure of the duty within a standard of practice to determine negligence.
The BPELSG is the authority over the individual’s license and again, does not determine negligence – unless Ric Moore is inferring something I may have overlooked. The inference to the licensed surveyor being “if you do not practice as we [BPELSG staff/Dallas] say your license status will be put into question”, however inappropriate as a threat, it may be something to ponder.
Edward Reading, I have no issue with Dallas Sweeney, to my recollection I have only met him once.
Any name presented to me as a single source land surveyor being able to provide the “best answer” on a practice issue would trigger my questions as to the qualifications to provide the “best answers”. Now layer that best answer statement with being the single source that agencies “will have to listen to” and it gets complicated. Suddenly, as it was framed, the credentials should become important to any responsible practicing land surveyor.
I believe Dallas Sweeney has been licensed about 10 years and has been at BPELSG about five of those years. BPELSG land surveyors, Ric Moore and Dallas Sweeney, are state employees and are likely prohibited from practicing in the same field they regulate – I would bet on it. Napkin math would indicate approximately 50% of Ric Moore and Dallas Sweeney’s licensed career has been spent not practicing land surveying. Restated, 50% of their respective licensed years have been working as a testing regulator and managing subject matter experts – together with other administrative tasks. To put a finer point on it, we are talking about nonpracticing land surveyors providing the “best answers” to the practicing public and private surveyors in multiple jurisdictions by word of mouth on an individual by individual basis. That should make any professional uncomfortable.
Additionally, I have not read any peer reviewed publications from either Ric Moore or Dallas Sweeney that would indicate a bottomless well of land surveying knowledge. Based on my own experience, the “best answers” come from a group or minimally, vetted by an informed peer group, are presented as part of a public review process, and published in writing for all practitioners to adopt. For example, the Guide to Records of Survey and Corner Records published by the County Engineers Association of California (“CEAC”).
Why are written opinions, guides, manuals important? It is the best defense against a negligence allegation.
I have no reason to believe Dallas Sweeney, who, again, I have met one time, is anything other than a wonderful human being. He is sure to be as qualified as any other land surveyor with similar years of experience and background. I genuinely hope to get to know him over the next few years. However, as a professional land surveyor, when questioned by a client, judge or attorney as to my procedures, practice or decision process I will not state in my defense “…because Dallas Sweeney told me to” for which he should be thankful. It would be irresponsible for any land surveyor to hang their professional liability on a conversation or a standard that is not published. It may help to think in the terms of a County Surveyor’s signature on a record of survey – the licensee is responsible for the work and County Surveyor is not, not in the least. Any licensee that changes a map to accommodate a County Surveyor had better change the map in a way that will provided an affirmative defense. Stating “the county told me to do it” is not a defense. I have seen this play out firsthand in a courtroom and several times in depositions.
I find it curious BPELSG staff would try to assume such a wildly inappropriate and outsized role in the professional community without the usual public process resulting in a written guide or policy. They cannot even find their way to publish precedent setting cases (I believe there is only one case in the last 30 years and that case, John Combs ((deceased)), serves as a poor example).
As to Edward Reading’s referenced webinar, that excluded the private surveying community, the idea of establishing parity between jurisdictions is certainly a good idea. However, the public and private licensed individuals in the jurisdictions have completed this process through CEAC, resulting in a published guide, with input through the League of California Surveying Organizations, ACEC and CLSA. There may be a role for BPESLG staff as it relates to regulation, but to think or more critically, to state, Dallas Sweeney is the only person practicing land surveyors need to listen to is absurd and irresponsible. The idea any single individual would promote and/or accept this role, without an organized process of public participation resulting in written guidance, actually demonstrates there is a problem.
In closing, any would be defenders of Ric Moore or Dallas Sweeney that feel compelled to write their sentiments please save your key strokes for another thread. I am sure they are both great guys. If you want to talk about them as individuals, you are missing the point entirely. This is conversation about professional practice (thank you Dave L.), not feelings. If anyone can add more to their professional qualifications and the authority to dictate professional practice by edict, please proceed. I welcome many different perspectives - as a professional, I recognize the importance of many varying opinions to help me navigate.
DWoolley
PS Steve Wilson, the former land surveyor BPELSG member, as was his prerogative, did not make use of the Land Surveyor Technical Advisory Committee (“LSTAC”). This was a great disservice to the professional community. We now need a leader with a voice that recognizes the importance of a land surveying specific agenda and the role of the professional community participation through the LSTAC. Our esteemed Governor appears to have his hands full at the moment, but in time I hope he appoints a proactive land surveying leader to the BPELSG.