Exemptions for prevailing wage

[MikeTurnrose]

Are there any exemptions in California for prevailing wage for surveyors on projects requiring such? Do you have to be over 18 to work on such projects?

[dmi]

my limited experience is that there are no exemptions, but it depends on the terms of the project agreement. An owner/operator could pay themselves sub-par wages, but you will not get away with that for your employees. Most likely you will need to hire an apprentice out of the hall or have your young protege join the union, but the union will want you to use the out of work list.

[MikeTurnrose]

What about if the rod man is my son? Are there family exemptions?

[dmi]

the project agreement is probably going to require that he join the Union, it just depends. Turning your business into a union shop is probably a bigger problem that just paying the wages and bennies

[mpallamary]

You should be able to submit a certified payroll without joining the union. I did that whenever I worked a prevailing wage job. My company was never associated with a union.

[E_Page]

Mike T. - I don't believe there is any exemption for family employees, only for the owner and limited exemption for designated management employees.

I'm quite certain that you cannot hire an apprentice without having a journeyman level chainman already on the crew. You would have to check this, but I'm pretty sure that there is also a maximum ratio of apprentices to journeyman chainmen/I-men/chiefs that a company may hire. It's been a while since I was in the Operating Engineers. Things may have changed a bit here & there in the rules.

But as Mike P pointed out, the prevailing wage laws do not specify that you must be union. They specify that you must provide a certain level of wages and benefits for your employees working on prevailing wage projects. Those wages & benefits just so happen to reflect whatever the latest union agreement arrived at. If your work on prevailing wage jobs is sporadic or rare, joining the union won't make much sense. If those projects become a major part of your practice, joining the union may be the most convenient path.

I suggest that you speak with someone who has already done this, and particularly someone who may have had a family member working with them.

You know, I think such a person has previously replied to this thread.

[dmi]

I did not suggest that it was the prevailing wage law that required union membership. My experience is that the project agreement in place will dictate whether or not a contractor has to be a union shop. As with anything there are always exceptions. I worked for a large firm that had many clients that were small cities and towns and sewer districts and water districts and they managed to field non-union crews on prevailing wage jobs all the time, so yes it can be done.

[Jim Frame]

2.) Land surveying work that is not related to construction, such as boundary work-in most instances, is not required to pay prevailing wage. This can include topography if the work is not "immediately" prior to construction or related to construction. Cal. Labor Code § 1720(a)(1) regarding construction design and pre-construction and also to the Veritas case (2002-002, July 19, 2002)

Be careful here. The Veritas case, which is consistent with DIR's findings in the Calipatria/Tesco case (1991), found that the boundary and topographic surveys were subject to PW because the awarding agency had a project in mind when the survey work was performed. Construction might or might not follow, and it might follow months or years later, so the concept of "immediately prior to construction" is misleading.

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[Jim Frame]

I'm a little confused.

First, who's Charlie Gordon, and who wrote the 4:39 post, Charlie or Dave?

Second, the question "Why am I working on this?" was never actually answered. Is it because Charlie/Dave doesn't want to be thought of as a mechanic, or because he doesn't want to pay his crews prevailing wages?

I'm just trying to figure out whether or not I have a dog in this fight.

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[Jim Frame]

Dave, thanks for forwarding the Maxwell letter. As I read it, the Wage and Hour Division ruled that survey personnel will only be considered subject to Davis-Bacon standards when they perform "primarily physical and/or manual work." It also says that more detailed guidance will be issued "in the near future." It didn't come across as being definitive one way or the other.

Even if Davis-Bacon interpretations change, I'm not sure that'll have any effect in California. The linkage between Davis-Bacon and California's equivalent has never seemed very firm to me.

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[Stephen Johnson]

I'm a little confused.

First, who's Charlie Gordon, and who wrote the 4:39 post, Charlie or Dave?

Second, the question "Why am I working on this?" was never actually answered. Is it because Charlie/Dave doesn't want to be thought of as a mechanic, or because he doesn't want to pay his crews prevailing wages?

I'm just trying to figure out whether or not I have a dog in this fight.

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Charlie Gordon: Lead Character in the movie "Charly" AKA "Flowers for Algernon" Starring Cliff Robertson.

[Jim Frame]

Jim, your harrumph has been noted.

No harrumphing here -- I appreciate your interest in the matter and your willingness to pursue it. It's just not something that's effectively competing for my time right now. That may be the result of a misunderstanding of the subject's import, and I'm willing to revisit the issue if someone can convince me to do so.

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