Where has all the money gone?

[7702]

Dear Administrator,

CLSA's reported annual revenue appears to have been pretty consistent (+/- half a million dollars) even through the lean years of this last recession. However, as reported on the completed tax forms for years 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, and 2012, the end result is ALWAYS a decrease in assets (cash and savings) at year's end, EVEN when yearly revenue EXCEEDS yearly expenses. Tax year 2012, for example, indicates that total revenue exceeded total expenses, yet CLSA assets (cash and savings and a copy machine) were reported as $104,000 less at years end.

That's a pretty leaky bucket that someone should have plugged by now.

Is CLSA being robbed?

I would appreciate a prompt reply.

Thank you.

[7702]

I will also attempt to contact CLSA's CPA tomorrow to see what his explanation is.. If successful in contacting him, I will report my findings on this forum.

Sincerely,

[7702]

Dear Executive Committee,

CLSA's reported annual revenue appears to have been pretty consistent (+/- half a million dollars) even through the lean years of this last recession. However, as reported on the completed tax forms for years 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, and 2012, the end result is ALWAYS a decrease in assets (cash and savings) at year's end, EVEN when yearly revenue EXCEEDS yearly expenses. Tax year 2012, for example, indicates that total revenue exceeded total expenses, yet CLSA assets (cash and savings and a copy machine) were reported as $104,000 less at years end.

That's a pretty leaky bucket that someone should have plugged by now.

Is CLSA being robbed?

Your members would appreciate a prompt reply.

Thank you.

__________________

[7702]

Dear Executive Committee,

CLSA's reported annual revenue appears to have been pretty consistent (+/- half a million dollars) even through the lean years of this last recession. However, as reported on the completed tax forms for years 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, and 2012, the end result is ALWAYS a decrease in assets (cash and savings) at year's end, EVEN when yearly revenue EXCEEDS yearly expenses. Tax year 2012, for example, indicates that total revenue exceeded total expenses, yet CLSA assets (cash and savings and a copy machine) were reported as $104,000 less at years end.

That's a pretty leaky bucket that someone should have plugged by now.

Is CLSA being robbed?

Your members would appreciate a prompt reply.

Thank you.

__________________

[marois]

Well Mark not to be disrespectful, and I appreciate your diligence. But I’m not a CPA and I suspect you not either. Attached is a copy of CLSA’s end year balance sheet for 2013, I was able to obtain a copy for the “Members Onlyâ€￾ section of the website, perhaps you should consider joining, it shows that CLSA made a little over $42,000.00 last year. That doesn’t seem like a “leaky bucketâ€￾, but then again I’m no bean counter. By the way how did go we CLSA’s accountant today?

Armand Marois
PLS 5941
(760) 931-8700 ext 240
amarois@bhaincsd.com

[7702]

Thank you for appreciating my diligence. It has been very exhausting trying to make sense of all this.

But I’m not a CPA and I suspect you not either.

No need to suspect, I've stated numerous times that I'm not a CPA. My aunt is though. Does that count?

Thank you for posting the 2013 year end balance sheet. I was not privy to that information. The bucket seemed to have a lot of holes in it from 2009-2012, and apparently for 2014 as well. That's one year out of six that looks encouraging but now rumor has it, 2014 is a bust.

Regarding the CLSA accountant, you undoubtedly already know how that turned out. So far, he has declined the opportunity to speak with me, which is pretty much what I expected. I'm still researching accountant responsibilities on the CPA licensing board website and the state CPA association. I will keep you posted on that as well.

Respectfully,

[7702]

I'm certainly not a CPA, but it appears that Schedule "J" should be required in order to disclose compensation to the CLSA Executive Director.

Has the attached Schedule "J" been filed with the 2013 990 Tax form?

If not, please provide an explanation.

Thank you.

***poster is NOT a CPA***(im-poster?)

[7702]

Has the 2013 tax return been filed yet?

If so, can someone please post a copy of the 2013 990 tax return, along with any and all related 990 Schedules?

(Per Federal filing requirements, Filed 990 tax returns are to be made available for public inspection)

Thank you,

[bryanmundia]

Curious question, why do we have a projector, laptop, copier, microphone system, etc. listed on our asset sheet if those are all things that AMS is supposed to provide for the CLSA? Isn't that included in their fee based on the contract that has been posted on the forum?

Also, Mark, read my post in the other thread regarding Woolley and Pallamary. I think you might find the numbers interesting to read.

[7702]

According to the CPA, (see attached cpa1) the executive director is an independent contractor who is paid by AMS. However, I could not find a single expense related to AMS anywhere on the numerous filed returns that I reviewed. Why is that?

Also, is AMS and the ED compensated separately?

According to Form 990, Independent contractors that are compensated over a $100k a year are to be fully disclosed therein.

How much was the TOTAL compensation paid to AMS for tax years 2012 and 2013?

Also of interest is the attachment (ED-Comp) of a portion of 2013 Schedule "J", showing where one would potentially disclose a certain type of compensation to an Executive Director.

Thank you.

[dmi]

Ask the IRS how to properly fill out the 990. I understand the accountants argument on how to fill out the form, but it appears to be misleading to do as they suggest.

So get an opinion simply

[7702]

Thanks Dane.

I'm a bit buried right now. Could you research that for me?

[bryanmundia]

Ask the IRS how to properly fill out the 990. I understand the accountants argument on how to fill out the form, but it appears to be misleading to do as they suggest.

So get an opinion simply

Not so simple, there are over 24 different forms and sets of instructions to read through that are included within the 990 Form.

Not to mention they are written for an accountant to understand, not a layperson.

Do you have the time Dane?

[dmi]

Instead of a bunch of lay people quibbling over something that they do not understand, why not ask for advice, that is the point Apparently it was never done by the people having direct responsibility for these matters the ED, Excom and the association's accountant.

So no I do not have the time to sort this out and even if I did I would not rely on my opinion because IT WOULD NOT BE DEFINITVE.....

Did I miss something here? If you won't accept the opinion of the ED, excom or accountant, then what is the alternative....?

[7702]

Mr. Marois,

Will you please post a copy of the 2013 tax statement, assuming it has been filed already? Is that too much to ask?

The law requires it be made available for public inspection. Not just for BOD or Member inspection, but for public inspection. (that includes me!)

Thank you!

[7702]

Dane,

You don't have to know how to bake a cake in order to tell whether it's any good or not. : )

[marois]

Mr. Marois,

Will you please post a copy of the 2013 tax statement, assuming it has been filed already? Is that too much to ask?

The law requires it be made available for public inspection. Not just for BOD or Member inspection, but for public inspection. (that includes me!)

Thank you!

Mark--I do not have a copy of the tax return, but you can contact the Central Office (707) 578-6016 and I'm sure one can be provided.

Armand Marois
PLS 5941
(760) 931-8700

[7702]

Mark--I do not have a copy of the tax return, but you can contact the Central Office (707) 578-6016 and I'm sure one can be provided.

Armand Marois
PLS 5941
(760) 931-8700

Isn't that what I've been doing repeatedly for days, via this forum, with no response?

I'm sure that you can round one up in a hurry and post it here. Please do so.

Thank you.

[E_Page]

The AMS employees do not normally participate in the forum unless they are posting an announcement of some kind, (username: Administrator) or have been notified of some violation of forum rules that they need to look into and possibly address.

But if you actually call them, I'm sure that whoever you speak with will be courteous, cooperative, and professional.

Don't continue to presume that you should get a response from them due to postings on this forum. doing so and then later saying they never answered your many requests would be disingenuous after having been told what I've just informed you of.

[7702]

Thanks Evan. I was remembering a couple of recent responses in which the Administrator denied involvement with Mr. Myron and advised another member who did not receive a ballot.

Also, Mr. Marois was quick to post finacials supporting his opinions, so I assumed he would be willing to post othe information. The fact that he's not willing to do so, does not bode well for the claim that all is well on the home front.

Now that I've been duly informed, however, I will try a different approach.

Sincerely,

[7702]

As suggested earlier, I spoke with the Executive Director and she was polite and cooperative. I'm relaying this information from memory only and I'm trying to be as accurate as possible:

She was obviously very unhappy about forum comments implying that there has been any wrongdoing on the part of the Central Office or the organization as a whole.

She informed me that the revision of the bylaws has nothing to do with any potential disciplinary proceedings. It's just an unfortunate coincidence.

She verified that AMS is an independent contractor and other than travel related expenses, she is paid only by AMS.

The Central Office is not located at her residence.

She claimed not to know why AMS is never reported as an independent contractor on the 990 tax forms, and until these recent concerns were brought to her attention, she had never questioned the fact that her compensation was not disclosed in the Independent Contractor portion of Form 990. She didn't appear concerned, either, that the total compensation to AMS is never disclosed on the tax forms, as an independent contractor or otherwise.

She states the CPA and attorney fees thus far have been minimal, ($550 or so last year for the CPA?) so she wasn't too concerned that they are consistently listed as $0 on the tax forms.

She has recently been in contact with the CPA regarding these issues.

If I've reported anything in error, please advise.

I will keep my personal opinions to my self on this one.

Thank you.

[bryanmundia]

As suggested earlier, I spoke with the Executive Director and she was polite and cooperative. I'm relaying this information from memory only and I'm trying to be as accurate as possible:

She was obviously very unhappy about forum comments implying that there has been any wrongdoing on the part of the Central Office or the organization as a whole.

She informed me that the revision of the bylaws has nothing to do with any potential disciplinary proceedings. It's just an unfortunate coincidence.

She verified that AMS is an independent contractor and other than travel related expenses, she is paid only by AMS.

The Central Office is not located at her residence.

She claimed not to know why AMS is never reported as an independent contractor on the 990 tax forms, and until these recent concerns were brought to her attention, she had never questioned the fact that her compensation was not disclosed in the Independent Contractor portion of Form 990. She didn't appear concerned, either, that the total compensation to AMS is never disclosed on the tax forms, as an independent contractor or otherwise.

She states the CPA and attorney fees thus far have been minimal, ($550 or so last year for the CPA?) so she wasn't too concerned that they are consistently listed as $0 on the tax forms.

She has recently been in contact with the CPA regarding these issues.

If I've reported anything in error, please advise.

I will keep my personal opinions to my self on this one.

Thank you.

Mark,

If that is the case, are we asking for a W-9 from AMS? Shouldn't there be some sort of accountability on what the actual costs for their services are? Especially since it is a not to exceed amount as specified in another post.

[7702]

Mark,

If that is the case, are we asking for a W-9 from AMS? Shouldn't there be some sort of accountability on what the actual costs for their services are? Especially since it is a not to exceed amount as specified in another post.

The ED states that all of the information that is being requested is readily available to CLSA members, by following the proper channels.

She didn't wish to reveal the total amount of AMS' compensation package to me and I admit to not fully understanding the extent of the services that AMS provides. I think that said compensation includes rent of office space, etc., but it's best if someone else verifies that.

Per the CPA's letter that's been posted, AMS is provided with a 1099 form for tax filing purposes. The ED acknowledged that AMS receives one 1099 form reporting all independent contractor compensation to AMS/ED for the prior tax year.

[marois]

Mark to reiterate I do not have any copies of any CLSA’s tax returns, the ones that have shown up on the forum have been posted by Mr. Pallamary, and my understanding he received the copies from the Central Office. The financial report that I posted was already on the “Members Onlyâ€￾ section of the website. So I would contact Central Office to request a copy of the 2013 tax return.
Now for some issues I have regarding the postings that have been occurring over the last few days. First does CLSA need to find a new CPA, absolutely, clearly he thought CLSA was a minor client which did not require or deserve his best effort. And I would hope the BOD will be looking for a replacement. Second regarding the attacks on Dorothy and AMS and I’m in complete agreement with Evan Page, see his post under the “Dave Wolley and Mike Palamaryâ€￾ thread. The title of this thread alone is sufficient to point out this a direct assault on AMS handling of CLSA. This is a public forum (which I think should be moved to the members only area of the website, but that’s another topic) and anyone can view the discussions. If I’m a client of AMS and saw these posting questioning Dorothy and her management company, I might consider revising my arrangement with AMS. Well if someone posted unsubstantiated claims about my company and I lost a client, we would be in court faster than a scalded dog. So you have to ask yourself are you prepared to sit on a witness stand and explained how you came to your findings.
Now if you have some serious concerns about what you are seeing and would like more information and have any questions answered here’s how the process works. Have a chapter meeting, involving your representatives, to review the issues, develop a list in which a majority of the membership agrees on, and forward the request (addressed to the Board of Directors) in order to be put on the next meeting’s agenda.

Armand Marois
PLS 5941
(760) 931-8700 ext 240
amarois@bhaincsd.com