LLA - Perimeter Description Required?

[Olin Edmundson]

Can a jurisdiction require a new perimeter description be prepared as a condition of approval for a Lot Line Adjustment? It's a two parcel adjustment, I've described the first new parcel as being all that portion of the two original parcels lying Northerly of a certain described line and the second as being all land lying Southerly of the same described line. Closure calculations are part of the required submital checklist but, of course, w/ this method there is no closed figure to calculate around.

[William Magee]

Their requirement is likely defeatable if push came to shove. Have you spoken with the LS in responsible charge? If so, do you feel you've exhausted the possibility of reasoning with him or her? if so is your client willing to wait for you to go through the efforts necessary to, um, "convince" him or her of their lack of competence in evaluating legal descriptions?

[LS_8750]

How were the parcels described prior to this LLA?

If you are following suit with the prior description method, then I would say you are spot on.

If not, maybe the local jurisdiction has a point?

[Olin Edmundson]

No submittal yet, this is just a general question. Can a jurisdiction dictate the format of a description? Must a perimeter description be used, rather than, for example, the more basic method of describing the portion(s) of land being transferred?

In this particular case, the existing properties are described vaguely along their Northerly lines as "running along an old fence" with no bearings or distances given. If a full perimeter description with bearings, distances and closure calculations were required, this would force a fully resolved survey on these Northerly lines. This would be difficult, to say the least, and the clients have no interest in knowing their position.

[Ian Wilson]

In short, yes, they can specify the type of description...if it's managed by local ordinance. Of there's no ordinance, then, no. On the other hand, the books at the local agency is going to have to approve the description. Unless your client can go to court to get a writ of mandamus, you're in for a tough fight. More later

[Olin Edmundson]

Ok. So, if I am understanding you correctly Ian, it is illegal, but if it's written into their code and they won't reason w/ you, then someone has to go to court to have a judge tell them to back off.

[Warren Smith]

It's a matter of using the parent parcel description, then using consistent qualifiers to describe the portions. Then it's all good. Think of a retracing surveyor 30 years from now - with whatever measuring tools they may be using.

[Ian Wilson]

For some reason, we’ve developed a disconnect between what is being requested of us and what a legal description really is. We’ve also developed a sort of amnesia regarding who can write descriptions. We need to make an effort to change this.

First, re-read §8726 of the PLS Act.

8726. A person, including any person employed by the state or by a city, county, or city and county within the state, practices land surveying within the meaning of this chapter who, either in a public or private capacity, does or offers to do any one or more of the following:
(a) Locates, relocates, establishes, reestablishes, or retraces the alignment or elevation for any of the fixed works embraced within the practice of civil engineering, as described in Section 6731.
(b) Determines the configuration or contour of the earth’s surface, or the position of fixed objects above, on, or below the surface of the earth by applying the principles of mathematics or photogrammetry.
(c) Locates, relocates, establishes, reestablishes, or retraces any property line or boundary of any parcel of land, right-of-way, easement, or alignment of those lines or boundaries.
(d) Makes any survey for the subdivision or resubdivision of any tract of land. For the purposes of this subdivision, the term “subdivision” or “resubdivision” shall be defined to include, but not be limited to, the definition in the Subdivision Map Act (Division 2 (commencing with Section 66410) of Title 7 of the Government Code) or the Subdivided Lands Law (Chapter 1 (commencing with Section 11000) of Part 2 of Division 4 of this code).
(e) By the use of the principles of land surveying determines the position for any monument or reference point which marks a property line, boundary, or corner, or sets, resets, or replaces any monument or reference point.
(f) Geodetic or cadastral surveying. As used in this chapter, geodetic surveying means performing surveys, in which account is taken of the figure and size of the earth to determine or predetermine the horizontal or vertical positions of fixed objects thereon or related thereto, geodetic control points, monuments, or stations for use in the practice of land surveying or for stating the position of fixed objects, geodetic control points, monuments, or stations by California Coordinate System coordinates.
(l) Determines the information shown or to be shown within the description of any deed, trust deed, or other title document prepared for the purpose of describing the limit of real property in connection with any one or more of the functions described in subdivisions (a) to (f), inclusive.

The real deal is that last paragraph.

Note that there are no exceptions to this. There isn’t a paragraph that says unless you passed the bar, and then, you can write descriptions, too. There isn’t an exception for the title folks, either. I’ve been teaching description writing for more than a decade, now. I challenge students in every class to bring me the citation for ANY exception in the statutes. So far…nothing.

So, unless you are authorized to practice land surveying (PLS for the rest of the article), you are not qualified to write the body of a land description.

Full Stop.

End of story.

Let that sink in.

Oh, and you aren’t qualified to review descriptions written by PLSs, at least not without the oversight of a competent PLS.

The City Engineer, unless they are a “pre-82” PE or have a PLS, cannot determine what goes into the body of the description. Unless the agency requesting the description has a misplaced ordinance that requires such a Metes & Bounds description or some other format. Sorry, but the statutes are very clear. Only PLSs can write descriptions. Only PLSs can determine what goes in the description. Only PLSs can decide what format is best for the particular purpose of the description. No exceptions.

Now, the second part: what are we trying to do?

A description should describe a single, unique piece of land without any equivocation or ambiguity. The description should stand the test of time. It should be surveyable – not by anyone, but a competent person authorized to practice land surveying.

The surveyor writing the description should be the one who determines the form of the description, unless there is a specific reason for something else. For example, take the scenario where the description is for a 5-foot-wide sidewalk easement that will extend along the easterly side of a parcel of land and the easterly line of the easement should be the same line as the easterly line of the parcel and the easterly line of the parcel is a straight line. A really good description of the strip would be “…the easterly 5/00 feet of Parcel B of Parcel Map X, recorded…” It simple. It is not ambiguous. It is easily surveyed by a competent surveyor. And, when its signed and stamped by a PLS, it places the liability on the surveyor’s shoulders. Done!

There is no need for a “Metes & Bounds” description every time. And keep in mind that “Metes & Bounds” really means “just the metes so we can put it into a cheap program to see if it closes even though you signed the description and took the liability.”

Descriptions should be kept as simple as possible. All those flowery words? They just trip things up down the road. Don’t agree? Read a description from the 1920s. “All that certain parcel of land situate in the City of Emerald City in the State of Silliness...” And it will get worse.

I have an intern from Fresno working with me this summer. This poor guy spent a few weeks teasing out a wad of descriptions of easements just south of San Francisco. In the end, one of the most important lessons he’s learned is that all that extra ink is just trouble and doesn’t do a thing to protect any property rights.

Keep the description simple. If two words will work as well as four, chose the two words.

It’s “A parcel of land in Emerald City, California…”

If the description begins at a point on the parcel, it has a Point of Beginning only. If the description starts somewhere off the parcel, then it has a Point of Commencement and a Point of Beginning. There is no such thing as a False Point of Beginning. You don’t have to identify the POB as a “True” POB.

Think of writing description like playing golf. The lower the score (or word count), the better.

Why is that?

Simple.

The more words, the easier it is to drop a line or two when doing the old “copy/paste” routine.

Have you ever tried to plot a description that reads something like “…thence North 84°15’ 22” along the west line of known as Main Street…” Hmmm. Missed a line or two there. The description doesn’t close by 37 feet. Now what?

The “…easterly 5.00 feet of Parcel B…” is really hard to screw up with cut/paste.

Now, back to the real world.

The EIT has reviewed your description and sent you their comments. They want a Metes & Bounds description because the check list has to be checked. They want a POB because the check list…

You call up and ask to speak to someone in charge. And they tell you that it has to be a metes and bounds description.

Well, you could discuss the point, usually a losing proposition from my experience. Or you could just bite your tongue and write a metes and bounds description. Or you could just work for clients who can have stables of attorneys ready to take such matters to court for a Writ of Mandamus. Read time and money.

Yeah. That’s it.

Now, there have been times when the person at the agency listens to me, hears my arguments and we come up with a compromise somewhere between our two positions. And, you people know who you are and you have my continued gratitude!

OK, you touched a sore spot.

Descriptions.

They’re really quite easy to put together if you are qualified and have experience! A description that is not the one that you might not have written in the same circumstances is not wrong!

Descriptions are one of the main messages we send forward to the surveyors of the future. Let’s make sure we know what we’re doing with them before we start trying to write them or review them.

[Ian Wilson]

Olin:

Warren is one of the "Good Ones".

[Warren Smith]

Thanks, Ian!

[Edward M Reading]

Olin:

Warren is one of the "Good Ones".

Can confirm.

[RAM]

my take is NO. There are several formats for describing a tract of land and as Ian stated only a PLS can define the contents of a description. The Agency Surveyor can suggest corrections on a technical basis, of the content and that the description is valid, however the style the author uses is up to the author.

I will second the confirmation of Warren, maybe he will buy me a cup of coffee later today.