Record of Survey Errors

[rpost]

I am performing a survey (San Diego) adjoining a recent Record of Survey (6 months old). Upon reviewing the survey, I have found several pertinent errors.

1. Dimensional busts
2. Basis of Bearings that is not part of the map. It looks like it was copied from an old project.
3. Monument with no description
4. Monument with bad description
5. I also found a "No Record" monument on a line that the map established by holding a record dimension.

Usually, I overlook minor issues, but this map needs some work. I am planning on contacting the surveyor and letting him know what I have found.

My question is, what is the best approach for something like this and how would the surveyor amend the map if he agrees to make the revisions? Additionally, if he does not agree to revise the map, what is the next step? JPPC?

[pls7809]

Some would say send the survey to the board. I lean towards your suggestion, but perhaps I would check with the board to see if there are other previous issues the surveyor has had. Maybe they are in a probationary period for a previous offense of a similar nature.

I would suggest a letter asking for a response within a certain amount of time. If you know their number, call and then send the letter as a follow-up. If they don't do anything try the PPC route, or the board route.

The first four on your list could be fixed with a cert of correction, IMO. But the last one could change a boundary line, or line of title and they would need a new RS for that.

[wingding]

This sound like a Tuesday to me.
all the old maps in my area are substandard by todays standards.
me personally - I would not do a thing other than note it on my own survey

[mpallamary]

Without a doubt, I would reach out to the surveyor. We must elevate the profession and to do otherwise, is nothing short of bad manners and poor practice. So as to protect yourself and your client, start with a phone call (not email) and express your concerns. You should then follow up with a written communication and allow that person to correct their work. Do not embarrass him/her and DO NOT refer them to the Board. Everyone makes mistakes and everyone should be afforded the chance to correct an error. Do the right thing and show some class.

Here is what Curt Brown said on this topic: LAND SURVEYORS ETHICS

DISCOVERED ERRORS

In the event a land surveyor discovers an error or disagrees with the work of another land surveyor, it is the duty of that surveyor to inform the other surveyor of such fact. Surveys are not for the purpose of stirring up arguments and fights between neighbors. If the adjoining property has been surveyed by another surveyor and the two surveys are not in agreement, the matter should be discussed between the surveyors prior to announcing that an error exists. Sometimes evidence found on the first survey may indicate that a different principle should be used in the later survey. Of course, if a surveyor has made a genuine error, other surveyors should not honor the error, but the first surveyor should be given an opportunity to prove the correctness of his survey if he can.

DISCREDIT TO THE PROFESSION

It is unprofessional to act in any manner or engage in any practice which will tend to bring discredit on the honor or dignity of the Engineering and or Land Surveying Professions. A surveyor should not aid a client in perpetrating a fraud nor assist him in an illegal act. He should not, in his personal appearance or manner of conduct before the public or others, bring discredit to himself as a professional man.

PROFESSIONAL REPUTATION

The surveyor or engineer does not attempt to injure falsely or maliciously, directly or indirectly, the professional reputation, prospects, or business of another surveyor or engineer.
Confidence in and respect for a profession are gained by praise of one member for another. Constant sniping between professional people can only degrade the profession.
This ethical rule prohibits the engineer or surveyor from “falsely” or “maliciously” harming the reputation of another. This does not prohibit the right of any surveyor to give proper advice to those seeking relief from negligent surveyors. Surveyors should expose, at the proper time and place, dishonest conduct in their profession and should not hesitate to accept employment that will assist a client who has been wronged. But it is distinctly bad taste and ill manners to accept the word of the client without first checking with the colleague. Many times those making the accusations are not entirely unbiased in their presentation of their side of the story.

[Ric7308]

I am performing a survey (San Diego) adjoining a recent Record of Survey (6 months old). Upon reviewing the survey, I have found several pertinent errors.

1. Dimensional busts
2. Basis of Bearings that is not part of the map. It looks like it was copied from an old project.
3. Monument with no description
4. Monument with bad description
5. I also found a "No Record" monument on a line that the map established by holding a record dimension.

Usually, I overlook minor issues, but this map needs some work. I am planning on contacting the surveyor and letting him know what I have found.

My question is, what is the best approach for something like this and how would the surveyor amend the map if he agrees to make the revisions? Additionally, if he does not agree to revise the map, what is the next step? JPPC?

With all due respect to the previous responses you received and based on the scope of what you have provided, I offer this for the three land surveyors that are actually involved in this situation since any other surveyor at this point doesn't matter:

First Surveyor (rpost - the retracement surveyor): Ryan, bring it to the attention of the private land surveyor as a professional courtesy and offer to share whatever information you have pertinent to the issues you've identified in an effort to assist. Explain that he or she may wish to meet with the County Surveyor in a collaborative effort and that he or she can feel free to contact the Board for help in better understanding possible resolutions related to issues. While it is commendable that you have proceeded in this way and have the questions yourself, its important for that other land surveyor to ask the same questions and hopefully grow from this experience.

Second Surveyor (one who was in responsible charge of the map): Be receptive to another professional contacting you in a positive manner. Seek assistance from the County Surveyor. Call the Board seeking help in understanding your options. Don't dismiss the attempts by others to help as there may be something in response that helps the first surveyor as well as you.

Third Surveyor (County Surveyor): Seek to help analyze the situation, first to resolve the issues as necessary and second to collaborate on how this could have occurred when, at a minimum, these issues got by at least two land surveyors. Things like this shouldn't happen with individuals that normally check and re-check everything as naturally as land surveyors do. Implement measures to minimize something like this happening again before the map actually gets recorded.

Good luck. I hope it all works out in a responsible manner. Don't hesitate to contact the Board for assistance.

[DWoolley]

Explain that he or she may wish to meet with the County Surveyor in a collaborative effort and that he or she can feel free to contact the Board for help in better understanding possible resolutions related to issues.

Seek assistance from the County Surveyor. Call the Board seeking help in understanding your options.

Don't hesitate to contact the Board for assistance.

Interesting. Does this technical assistance come from the LSTAC, the Board or did you mean Board staff? Precisely who would a practitioner call for assistance?

D. Woolley

[Edward M Reading]

Dave,
I have had great experiences when seeking assistance from both the Executive Officer and the Senior Registrar of the Board.
Ed

[Ric7308]

Interesting. Does this technical assistance come from the LSTAC, the Board or did you mean Board staff? Precisely who would a practitioner call for assistance?

D. Woolley

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